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litespeed
Starting Member
USA
42 Posts |
 Posted - 02/02/2008 : 01:44:05
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I have just recently got into thinking of building a wind generator. It looks to be very interesting. I am totally intrigued. I have already built an anemometer and have been monitoring wind speeds for the past 2 months. Now I want to dive in and try to build a simple wind generator to charge the batteries in our RV.
I have 4 Ametek motors and I am trying to decide which one to use or if it is even worth it? I have 2 50VDC long body (7 inch), 1 38VDC and 1 40VDC. I have found quite a bit of info. on the 38 and 40 but not too much on the 50? Should I just chuck all of these and look for a lower RPM motor? Or will one of them work? Common since says that the 50 should produce more amps. It is much heavier and has "more in it". But if I have to spin up to 400 RPM's to make any power it seems like a moot point.
Are there any other good generator solutions out there that anyone is using? I see quite a bit out there and there are several surplus places near by. I just need to know what to look for.
AJ
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speo
Junior Member
Canada
109 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2008 : 03:28:40
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Certain models of Ametek 50 are better than 38, 40, and 30 models.
I played recently with one Ametek 50 that was very similar with the Ametek 30 in terms of volt/turn, but it has a lower coil resistence. I consider the lower resistence an indication of the motor being capable of pushing more amps into the battery.
What is the serial number of your Ametek 50? Mine was #116339-00
I would chuck them and see which one has the lowest RPM and I would also measure the coils resistence. If the lower RPM and lowest resistence are for the same motor, that's the one I'd use.
Speo
www.windpulse.com |
Edited by - speo on 02/02/2008 03:35:56 |
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litespeed
Starting Member
USA
42 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2008 : 14:47:27
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Speo,
Interesting. I was thinking that these are higher RPM motors?
Here is the info off the side:
011188F7
"I.D. 119105"
4022781-02 EC 49700
01A (E56617) 116339-00
50 V.D.C. Nominal
AJ |
Edited by - litespeed on 03/02/2008 00:10:36 |
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speo
Junior Member
Canada
109 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2008 : 15:44:39
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AJ,
Here is mine. It seems like it's identical with yours.
I don't have the bench test numbers handy, but I'll get back later with them.
Indeed, the RPM is higher, but the voltage is higher too. On top of that, the winding resistence on this one is lower than Ametek 30, and 40.
Speo
www.windpulse.com |
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litespeed
Starting Member
USA
42 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2008 : 14:23:34
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Wow... That is good news! If it can produce what I need at a low enough RPM that is great. It seems that they are identical except for that top "F7" number. I have another 50VDC long body in storage. I will pull it out and have a look at that one too.
When you have it connected to a drill... How do you tell how many rpm's the drill is turning the motor? Is that an easy thing to do? If I can figure that out, I will test it and the other one.
I am currently waiting on my arbor and hub. When it comes I hope to have all of this together by the end of the month. I still have to build the blades, mount and pole.
I would really like to see the info. on your motor if you can find it. If I can find out how to test mine properly, I will post those results as well.
AJ
Sebastian, FL
Wind gen. in progress |
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speo
Junior Member
Canada
109 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2008 : 15:26:04
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To get the RPM you need a tachometer or a bicycle speedometer (computer):
http://cgi.ebay.com/AUTO-LASER-PHOTO-TACHOMETER-CASE-MEASURE-RPM_W0QQitemZ180212204253QQihZ008QQcategoryZ11704QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
or
http://cgi.ebay.com/Bicycle-Bike-LCD-Cycle-Computer-Speedometer-Odometer-i6_W0QQitemZ270208344553QQihZ017QQcategoryZ30108QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
The tachometer will read directly RPM and the bicycle computer can read speed and few of them read directly RPM. The one I pointed you to, is capable of reading the RPM direcly. If the bicycle computer cannot read the RPM, you can enter the wheel size 1667 and the speed showed on the screen multiplied by 10 is the RPM.
A quick and relatively accurate way to test your motor is to hook it to a battery and count the rpm and measure the volts. The numbers in "generator mode" should be close to the numbers in "motor mode". If you don't have a tachometer or a bicycle computer, attach a magnet to the shaft, place your finger close to the shaft and count how many times the magnet touches your finger in one minute. That's the RPM. You won't be able to keep up counting, so, make a mark on the paper every 4 hits - 1,2,3, mark, 1,2,3, mark, 1,2,3,mark....and count the marks after 1 minute...
I'll get back with the numbers I promised.
Speo
www.windpulse.com |
Edited by - speo on 03/02/2008 15:29:15 |
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Del
Junior Member
United Kingdom
368 Posts |
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gotwind
Forum Admin
United Kingdom
843 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2008 : 22:25:12
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Nice tip Del.
Those Digital Laser Photo Tachometers had passed me by.
The Max / Min RPM feature might also be useful.
Good find. |
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speo
Junior Member
Canada
109 Posts |
Posted - 04/02/2008 : 00:54:26
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AJ,
Here are the numbers for Ametek 50 #116339-00, compared to Ametek 30 - 0.03 #10 (the higher RPM version of Ametek 30) and also compared to Ametek 30 - 0.04 #01 (the lower RPM version of Ametek 30)
You can see that Ametek 30-004 beats Ametek 30-003 in terms of Voltage at the same RPM, but Ametek 30-003 beats Ametek 30-004 in terms of Amperage at the same RPM. Now check the Volts x Amps for Ametek 30-003 and Ametek 30-004, they are identical.
Now, the voltage of Ametek 50 is very close to the voltage of Ametek 30-004, is higher than Ametek 30-003, but look at the amperage now: Ametek 50 beats BY FAR both versions of Ametek 30, making three times more amps than the highest amperage of Ametek 30's.
If I were you, I would definitely choose the Ametek 50 #116339-00
Have fun,
Speo
www.windpulse.com |
Edited by - speo on 04/02/2008 01:19:40 |
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Del
Junior Member
United Kingdom
368 Posts |
Posted - 04/02/2008 : 18:24:05
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Speo,
Excellent bit of work mate.
I'm amazed by the performance of the Ametek 50. I wonder why this isn't widely known as it's three times as powerful than the 30's with no downside. It would be interesting to see the performance of the 38v units if you have one to test.
Cheers
Del. |
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speo
Junior Member
Canada
109 Posts |
Posted - 04/02/2008 : 20:45:57
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Thanks Del,
I think the challenge for this model of Ametek 50 is to design the right blades for low wind. Maybe a larger rotor with higher TSR will to do the trick.
Unfortunatelly, I don't have a 38 to test. I would love to put it on the same graph.
I will check some 40's when I have the chance and get back with another curve on those graphs (if it's worth it)
I just want to mention that not all versions of Ametek 50 have the same performance, the numbers I published are for this model:
Speo
www.windpulse.com |
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litespeed
Starting Member
USA
42 Posts |
Posted - 04/02/2008 : 23:58:45
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Speo,
That is awesome! I had no idea the 50 long was capable of producing those kind of amps (my main concern).
Thank you for taking the time to post this. You are right about the 50's There are several different varieties. I passed on a couple of the small ones in the local surplus store and grabbed these because of the size and weight (just winging it). Both of them are 116339-00.
Funny thing though... One of them seems to "cog" a little and the other is smooth as silk? Weird...
AJ
Sebastian, FL
Wind gen. in progress |
Edited by - litespeed on 07/02/2008 00:04:06 |
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speo
Junior Member
Canada
109 Posts |
Posted - 05/02/2008 : 06:39:45
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AJ,
You are welcome.
If you have access to a surplus store, check for an Indiana 24vdc (rated 24v@375), if you like its bench test numbers published in this thread: http://gotwind.forumco.com/topic~TOPIC_ID~337.asp
If you have a digital multimeter, can you check (and let us know) the winding resistence of your motors?
Thanks,
Speo
www.windpulse.com |
Edited by - speo on 05/02/2008 06:45:38 |
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litespeed
Starting Member
USA
42 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2008 : 00:15:51
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Speo,
That Indiana 24 looks sweet! That would be an excellent "Primary" generator. That is really what I am looking for. I'll keep my eyes open for one of those. Looks like it has a flange like the Ametek 20?
I'm completely new to all of this stuff. Please bare with me. Yes, I have a digital multimeter. How do I hook it up to check resistance? My electrics knowledge is about equivalent to plugging a plug into a socket! I'm learning though. Thank you. I will post what ever I can about these motors once I know how.
I have bought a diode and an arbor. Tomorrow I plan to go look for some scrap pipe, wire and steel to make the mount, run the conduit and make blades. I think that I may ultimately order a set of TLG's blades if all goes well.
Here is pic of the 2 50VDC Ametek long bodies (7 inch). The one at the top is in the middle being water proofed:
AJ
Sebastian, FL
Wind gen. in progress |
Edited by - litespeed on 07/02/2008 02:20:55 |
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speo
Junior Member
Canada
109 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2008 : 01:40:15
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AJ,
Set the multimeter on Ohms (on mine 200 ohms is the lowest) and hook the two wires from the mulimeter to the wires from the motor. Turn the shaft in a different position and measure again, do it few times in different positions for a complete turn.
If the motor stayed on the shelf for a while, you might want to let run for 5-10 minutes before measuring...I don't know, I'm thinking just to have a good contact between the brushes and the collectors.
Yes, Indiana 24VDC@375RPM has a flange like few Ameteks have.
Speo
www.windpulse.com |
Edited by - speo on 07/02/2008 02:15:23 |
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litespeed
Starting Member
USA
42 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2008 : 13:55:34
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Speo,
Do you mind if I send your graph data to Terry @ TLG wind power. I would like his advice on blade selection. I don't want to give out your information without permission.
Regards,
AJ
Sebastian, FL
Wind gen. in progress |
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Another Crazy Newbie!
